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| Author | Mac OS 7.5.2 to Leopard (Read 42444 times) | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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vts
8 MB  Posts: 10 
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on: June 17, 2008, 17:39
Hi everyone, glad to have found a site dedicated to System 7. Here's my situation: my dad has an old PowerPC Macintosh 7200/90 running System 7.5.2 (with OpenTransport) which he'd like to connect to his new iMac he bought a few days ago (which is running Mac OS X Leopard 10.5.3). The new Leopard iMac is connected via AirPort to our home network which consists of a bunch of other Windows computers, connected both wirelessly and cabled to our router which distributes the internet connection. The old System 7 Mac has never been connected to anything; it always used to work standalone. So before I had found this site, I just tried to connect the System 7 machine like I would any other computer: plug it into a free connection on the router using an standard-issue LAN/Ethernet cable, and configure it on the machine. That actually worked, insofar that the System 7 machine received an IP assigned from my router through DHCP. I could then even ping to it from any computer connected to our network. The problem is, though, that I couldn't get Mac OS X to communicate with it in any other way than just pinging (I've tried loads of AppleTalk and AppleShare stuff, none of which seemed to work). I noticed that on my router the status LED for the System 7 machine was green (indicating connection), whereas all the other connected machines had an orange LED (indicating activity). So I figured something must be wrong with the way the System 7 machine is communicating. I also tried to connect the System 7 machine directly to the Leopard machine, which also enabled me to ping it, but same as with the router: nothing more than that. With the green rather than the orange router LED in mind, I figured I'd try to update OpenTransport, thereby maybe getting it to communicate properly. I then found this site and the important updates section. Now the problem is that I have no way of installing any of these important updates. The System 7 machine has a CD drive and a Floppy drive. Since most of the updates are too big to fit on a Floppy, I figured I'd burn them to a CD and let System 7 read it. I first tried using a CD-RW (so I wouldn't waste an entire CD over 30MB), which it didn't even recognize. I later found out that that was because the CD drive is not capable of reading those. So I then tried using a regular CD-R, to which I burned the files using a standard Burn Folder on the Leopard machine. When I popped it into the System 7 machine, it recognized it, but came up with a popup saying that the disk could not be read, and asking me if I would like to "initialize" it. I suspect initializing means formatting, since it said I would lose all data on it if I did. Ok, so I figured I'd give the Apple CD/DVD Driver 1.4 update a shot. Since I couldn't get it to the System 7 machine using a CD, I had to write it to a floppy disk from a Windows machine, since the only other machine left around here with a floppy disk drive is an old Windows XP machine. So I formatted the floppy to FAT, downloaded the .hqx file, wrote it to the floppy and popped it into System 7. Problem: it couldn't read .hqx files. Ok, so the System 7 machine needs StuffIt Expander, which is also available from the important updates page. Only problem: it comes as a .hqx file. What the hell, you guys? How can I install StuffIt Expander if I need StuffIt Expander to install it? Ok, so I figured I'd download StuffIt on the Windows XP machine, extract it there, and then write whatever it extracted to the floppy disk. Only problem: the Windows StuffIt 12.x version I installed complained saying "Engine error: unknown format" when trying to expand the .hqx file. I then tried to have Mac OS X extract from the .hqx file, transfer it through our home network to the Windows XP machine, and write it to the floppy disk there. Problem now is that the System 7 machine doesn't know what to do with the files. It shows a floppy disk icon with "PC" written on it, and all the files on it have Windows' old 8.1 notation (you know, STUFFI~1.img) and an icon of a blank page with "PC" written on it in IBM-blue. When trying to open the file, it says "Could not open <file> because the program it was created with could not be found. Would you like to open it using SimpleText?". I then figured that might (for some reason) be due to the way Windows XP writes the files to the floppy disk, even though the floppy disk is formatted as FAT which should be fine. FAT is also the only option Windows XP would allow me to format it as. So I tried sharing the floppy disk drive on the windows machine and tried having Mac OS X write to it through our home network, hoping that might help, but to no avail: same problem. So yea, I'm stuck. I have no way of installing any of the updates. I'm actually considering writing a network file transfer tool in Pascal on the System 7 machine due to having no other choice. Any suggestions? |
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vts
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8 MB Posts: 10
Reply #1 on: June 17, 2008, 17:43
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I forgot to mention; please don't direct me towards the article on this site that explains how to connect Leopard to System 7. I've seen it, read it, and I need the OpenTransport update to be able to do it. Additionally, for Part II I've looked into ShareWay IP but I also have no way of putting it on System 7 for reasons explained above.
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helloimjoe
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Reply #2 on: June 17, 2008, 18:59
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I think what I did was... go to your imac, download the mac os x version and use it to unstuff the system 7 stuffit expander... the completely unstuffed system 7 version just fits on a floppy... I used a usb floppy drive to put it on a floppy from my imac but since you don't have that maybe email it to yourself, and on the xp machine then put it on a floppy? or if you know how (I don't) over the network from the leopard machine to the xp machine
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vts
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8 MB Posts: 10
Reply #3 on: June 18, 2008, 03:02
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joe: I've tried that, see my 2nd and 3rd last paragraph. I have no external floppy drive, so I don't really have a choice other than having the Windows XP machine write the floppy. Do you think it might work if the Mac OS X machine wrote the floppy? ie. is it worth it to go out and get an external floppy drive?
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wove
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1024 MB Posts: 1363
Reply #4 on: June 18, 2008, 06:04
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I am not sure what software you have installed on your machine along with 7.5.2, so it is difficult to know what you are capable of doing. While there are difficulties in getting file sharing working using AppleTalk, there are other ways to transfer files. WinXP and Mac OS X, both have the native ability to be ftp servers and OS X can be a web server. So if you have any internet software as part of your 7.5.2 install, you can connect to another machine. If your 7.5.2 install has ClarisWorks installed, you can use the communication module of Claris works to open a terminal session to your OS X machine. From there you can use the terminal commands "get" and "put" to move files from machine to machine. Almost every Mac Browser made has the ability to decode binhex (hqx) files, so if there is a browser you might try and open the .hqx file on the "PC" disk with whatever browser you may have have just to see if it is decoded. bill
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helloimjoe
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Reply #5 on: June 18, 2008, 08:02
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Transfering with floppies for os x to 7 has always worked well for me... but try wove's suggestions before spending $20 on a floppy drive. I just like how much easier it can be if your just trying to get a small file transfered fast.
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vts
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8 MB Posts: 10
Reply #6 on: June 18, 2008, 15:12
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bill - since the 7.5.2 machine has never been connected to any network before now, it does not have any internet software installed. I actually tried to install a browser when I had it hooked up to my router, but that didn't go as planned. I was able to install IE 4.x from an old Mac magazine's CD, but I couldn't get it to boot due to what I suspect is a shortage of RAM. I also tried some other browsers, but I couldn't get any of them to run. I do think it has ClarisWorks installed though, I'll try that and report back. Thanks! joe - transferring (small) files with floppy disks works fine, but I'll be damned if I'm going to give up on getting this network running 
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helloimjoe
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Reply #7 on: June 18, 2008, 18:57
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haha persistant aren't we? I usually give up..
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wove
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1024 MB Posts: 1363
Reply #8 on: June 18, 2008, 19:04
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Keep in mind that if you can ping the machine, you have the network working, you simply do not have it useful yet. Stubborn persistence can be a good thing. Keep trying and good luck. bill
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vts
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8 MB Posts: 10
Reply #9 on: June 18, 2008, 19:58
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I've done some digging and apparently I do have StuffIt Expander 5.1.2 installed, as well as BinHex 5.0. However, StuffIt fails to expand my .hqx file - it goes through the extraction process as normal without producing any errors, but after it's done extracting there are no files to be found in the extraction destination folder. I've tried using BinHex as well, which did not succeed in extracting the file either due to a checksum error. I also tried using ClarisWorks 3.0, but when trying to create a new Communications file I received an error that the "terminal services" were not found, and that the file was therefore not created.
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vts
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8 MB Posts: 10
Reply #10 on: June 18, 2008, 20:11
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Update: I've found a StuffIt 5.5 installer on an old MacFan (a local Mac magazine) CD. It still fails to expand my .hqx files though. Perhaps it matters that WinXP wrote them to the disk rather than Mac OS X?
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DaveRhodes
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32 MB Posts: 43 
Reply #11 on: June 18, 2008, 23:41
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Quote from: "vts" I then tried using a regular CD-R, to which I burned the files using a standard Burn Folder on the Leopard machine. When I popped it into the System 7 machine, it recognized it, but came up with a popup saying that the disk could not be read, and asking me if I would like to "initialize" it. I suspect initializing means formatting, since it said I would lose all data on it if I did.I think this might be your easiest thing to solve, if you haven't already. System 7 can only natively read CDs in HFS format. I've never had a CD-enabled classic Mac reject an HFS CD-R I've made. To make one, open Disk Utilities in Leopard. Make a new Disk Image. Make sure to select Mac OS Standard as the file format and one of the CD sizes. [Fig. 1] Put the files you want on the CD. If you need to unstuff something, do it when it's already on the CD and it should be fine. Afterwards, open the CD image in Disk Utility and burn it to a disc. Should work in any System 7 Mac. (http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/866/picture2py9.png) [Fig. 1] Also, as per your HQX problem... HQX files are a hexdump of a BIN file stored as raw text, designed to be moved across any OS. Windows XP shouldn't be corrupting them.
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DaveRhodes
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32 MB Posts: 43
Reply #12 on: June 18, 2008, 23:42
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and of course by "Disk Utilities" I mean Disk Utility, sorry.
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madmann
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256 MB Posts: 284 
Reply #13 on: June 19, 2008, 02:33
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that is correct the cd is the easiest to fix. the directions for burning a cd for use with os7 is in the help section of system7today along with how to network these machines together dan has a section devoted to osx to os 7 communication
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dpaanlka
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1024 MB Posts: 1646
Reply #14 on: June 19, 2008, 03:39
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Actually that stuff is down until I make a new Leopard version... although you can still find the old CD burning tutorial here: http://main.system7today.com/articles/tutorials/osxos7cdburning.html
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