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| Author | PB 1400 questions (Read 44460 times) | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Lichen Software
128 MB  Posts: 252  
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on: January 03, 2008, 16:49
I have several PB 1400's. I am going to ugrade them all as I find parts. The one I am using regularly has 64 MB memory, 333 Sonnet G3 upgrade, 30 GB Hard drive, 2 GB Compact Flash, Orinoco driven Lucent Technologies card (Silver). This machine sits in my kitchen and gets used for general web surfing and email. I have to get a new battery or get this one rebuilt and then it is also a cafe cruiser. Currently it is running 9.0.4 on the HD and 8.6 on the Compact Flash. I also want to try 7.6.1. As far as I can see this machine has the nicest keyboard of any machine I have used. So I do want to get the most out of it. Several questions: 1. SierraRedd mentioned a System Picker utility. I have tried to find this to download it and any links I can find seem dead. Does anyone have a source for this? Then I can have all three systems on at once and see what can be done with each. 2. Current wireless card software is ORiNOCO 7.2 from Agere Systems. Will this run on OS 7.6.1? 3. Has anyone experimented with different types of memory cards through to PCMCIA bus to see the speed differences? I am seeing the price of this type of memory come way down but it would be nice to know speed differences. 4. I am currently web surfing with a combination of browsers: WamCom Mozilla iCab 3.0.3 IE 5.1 Opera 6 The overall best performance is WamCom Mozilla. It is pokey but dependable. It's only problem seems to be rendering some fixed width pages in which the left side is cut off. iCab reders well, but turning off Java makes it run better while at the same time limiting its functions. IE 5.1 keeps giving Java errors and does not render as well, but it is quick. I am still playing with Opera. So far I am pleased. Will any of these run in 7.6.1? 5. Streaming Media I cannot get this machine to stream music well. I cannot get it to play YouTube. It will actually start up, but then it freezes. Has anyone had any luck with this? Lots of questions. Dave |
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wove
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1024 MB Posts: 1363
Reply #1 on: January 04, 2008, 14:24
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System Picker is part of the InfoMac Archive. < ftp://ftp.funet.fi/pub/mac/sysutil// > Of all the browsers you list only Explorer 5.1 will run on System 7.6. I do not have a PB 1400 so I have no definitive answers to questions specific to the that machine. bill
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Lichen Software
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128 MB Posts: 252
Reply #2 on: January 04, 2008, 16:09
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Quote from: "wove" System Picker is part of the InfoMac Archive. Thanks for that. I have downloaded it. Now I can play.
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madmann
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256 MB Posts: 284 
Reply #3 on: January 05, 2008, 00:45
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system picker works good between 7.6.1 and 8.x but i think their is a problem with using it for 9.X. Os 9 has the built in function of switching os. Wove would know more about this than i.
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wove
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1024 MB Posts: 1363
Reply #4 on: January 05, 2008, 02:28
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Quote from: "madmann" Wove would know more about this than i. That is probably not an accurate statement. I typically just change systems using the brute force method. I create a folder "unused system" place the System Folder I do not wish to boot from inside the folder. Then I remove the Finder from that system folder, which "unblesses" the folder. At that point I am free to pick another System Folder to boot from. The Startup Disk Control Panel from OS 9 works fine for picking a startup folder, as long as the System Folders reside on different volumes. I have not done any experimentation to see how early an OS can use the OS 9 control panel. If you keep different systems on different hard drives and the hard drives are SCSI hard drives, it is possible to select which hard drive to boot from using keyboard short cuts at startup. ( cmd-opt-shift-delete-#, where # represents the SCSI id of the drive you wish to start from) bill
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Lichen Software
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128 MB Posts: 252
Reply #5 on: January 13, 2008, 04:03
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Since I first posted on this, I reformatted my hard drive to give 6 partiitions: OS 7.6.1 2 Gb OS 8.1 2 Gb OS 8.6 2 Gb OS 9.0.4 2 Gb Virtual Memory 500 k Data 20 Gb Then I started installing systems and upgrading them. I have them all up and running except OS 8.1. I am finding that one to be particularly unstable. I may give up on that one and install and upgrade the orginal OS - 7.5 on that partition. Almost all the "essential 7.6 upgrades" are applicable to all of these systems. Speed doubler went into everything. The Speed doubler upgrade balked on OS 9.0.4. So I pulled the original Speed doubler extension out. On OS 9.0.4 and OS 8.6 I used ORiNOCO 7 for wireless networking. I used WaveLan 6 on 7.6. I like ORiNOCO much better. WaveLan is not as clear and seems finicky to set up. soemtimes it works and sometimes it does not. I am using a Lucent silver card for this. For web browsers: OS 9.0.4 and 8.6 have: WamCom Mozilla Opera 6 iCab 3 IE 5 OS 7.6 has: iCab 2 IE 5 Opera 5 Netscape 4.8 has given me some grief. But I think I am doing something stupid. Someone commented on assigning more ram to this before running - do it. It freezes up without it. I put 20 Mb. I then immediatley assigned more memory to all browsers before running them in 7.6 The best of all the browsers listed here is WAMCOM Mozilla. I think you need 8.6 for this one. It would be nice to find out what it is looking for and just put it into 7.6 if possible. Interesting observation is iCab 2 seems to run better than iCab 3. I was using iCab 3 on other machines and it seemed to feeze alot more. All versions are using Eudora for email. Version 5 for OS 9.0.4 and 8.6. Version 4.33 for OS 7.6. A comment or 2 on Eudora: Eudora 5 and Eudora 4 run almost identically. Both allow you to leave mail on the server so if you decide that you want to get your mail from your system 7.6 or other classic machine, you can do it and then go to your main machine and it will come in there also. Eudora 4.33 shows as an update if you download it from their site. What happens is, if you had actually paid for Eudora 4.x, it will update your paid version. Otherwise, it installs a new sponsered version. When Eudora was active this meant you had all the features, but had an advertisement pane on your screen. What you have now that they are not operating any more is a blank add pane on your screen. If you subscribe to email list servers, Eudora has a unique feature ( as far as I am aware). You set up your filters so that your list mail goes to separate mail boxes as in other email clients. But unlike other clients, it brings up the boxes as separate windows when mail arrives and most important, it only brings up a box if there is new mail. This means on a list server, you can scan the subjects and decide if you want to read them. Not reading or marking read the current emails will not cause the mail box to open next time you download mail. Eudora 4.33 runs very quickly on 7.6. What I would like to do now is strip down the higher OS versions to speed them up. 7.6 is far and away the fastest operating system. For many things it feels faster than my G4 1.5 GHz PowerBook running 10.4. The system appearance is quite retro. I have not had the chance to load a bunch of applications on and give it a go. I have to decide if Iwant to strip out the 8.1 partition and reinstall again from another source or go to my original install disks and put on 7.5. A note on the Sonnet extension. I tried downloading from here and I got a bad download ie it wouldnot expand properly with stuffit expander 5.5. Then I went to the Sonnet site and downloaded again. It also would not expand. So the fault is in the original file. It may be it is looking for a more recent version of Stuffit Expander. I have not had a chance to move it over to another machine and try again. Anyway, any thoughts on stripping down the higher systems or getting 7.6 to do WamCom greatly appreciated.
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wove
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1024 MB Posts: 1363
Reply #6 on: January 13, 2008, 04:46
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That is a nice informative post, Lichen Software, full of useful information. You are certainly digging into your 1400. I believe that the post was submitted twice, and I deleted the second instance. Thanks again for the informative post. bill
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Lichen Software
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128 MB Posts: 252
Reply #7 on: January 13, 2008, 15:44
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Quote from: "wove" I believe that the post was submitted twice, and I deleted the second instance. Sorry about that. I think I timed out while writing the post, so when I submitted it took me to the login. I figured that I had lost the post. It had happened to me once, so I had copied it first this time :-) Dave
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Lichen Software
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128 MB Posts: 252
Reply #8 on: January 13, 2008, 23:17
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I have been playing with browsers today and did a ClarisWorks install. First observation: Internet Explorer 5 was almost unusable on my Beige G3, 9.0.4, due to a multitude of Java Errors. I am not getting any on this PB1400 on OS 7.6.1. It is probably due to the Java Runtime update. I will run this update on the beige G3 and see what happens. I got Netscape to work turning off frames. It is an interesting browsing experience. If I stay this retro, I will have to get a machine shop and turn this PB 1400 into a SteamPunk version of the machine. It would just be too perfect. Actually, totally perfect would be to be able to go to YouTube and watch Bob Ross do one of his paintings on a SteamPunk PB 1400 running OS 7.6.1 - But I do not think that thisone will happen. iCab and Opera .... So far hit and miss. I have not turned frames off on these yet. I am still trying to keep some appearances. iCab in particular will freeze up the machine. Now, I am using the free version. I hear that the paid version is several iterations better. I installed ClarisWorks 5 on all of the partitions. It starts up great on 7.6.1. If you have an original Beige G3 install disk, you can dig around and find the Dataviz translators. I installed them and ClarisWorks recognized them all. Note on Dataviz - after you do a multiple install, you must reboot. When you reboot, it then goes and rebuilds the desktops on every partition that it was installed on. I have been using Eudora 4.33 all day checking email. It has been a stalwart performer all the way through. That's all for now. More as I go along here.
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dpaanlka
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1024 MB Posts: 1646
Reply #9 on: January 13, 2008, 23:37
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Do realize that you're not going to get a modern browsing experience at all with Mac OS 7.6.1, no matter what browsers or combinations of add-ons you install. Thats why System 7 Today recommends Netscape 4.8 - it can be configured to run the fastest, give you the least amount of annoying errors and crashes, and also display text and graphics in the most readable fashion. You just have to learn to like old fashioned experience.
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Lichen Software
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128 MB Posts: 252
Reply #10 on: January 14, 2008, 13:36
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Quote from: "dpaanlka" Do realize that you're not going to get a modern browsing experience at all with Mac OS 7.6.1, no matter what browsers or combinations of add-ons you install. LOL ... My favourite browser at one time as MacWeb. 7.6 is so much faster that I want to do as much as possible on it. There are however a set of sites that I do go to on a regular basis. Gradually I am getting things together so that this can be done. What you are getting is sort of blow by blow experience. It may help others trying to do the same thing ... Not complaining in any way shape or form. I am having a great time. :-)
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Lichen Software
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128 MB Posts: 252
Reply #11 on: January 27, 2008, 22:47
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I have been playing awhile on my PB 1400 since my last post. I get to use this machine each morning before anyone else gets up. You can find out how useful something is by how often you find yourself using it. I have OS's 9 8.6 8.1 7.6.1 running. I find myself using 7.6.1 all the time. 9 is far too slow. 8.6 I will use if I have to do something I cannot do on 7.6.1. 8.1 is unstable. My uses right now are web surfing and email. Email with Eudora 4.33 is lightning fast and has all the features I want - including leaving mail on the server so I can get it later on my main machine. Web browsing has been done using: IE 5 Netscape 4.8 iCab 2 Opera 5 I am not really imaginative when browsing. I pretty much go to the same places every day: EBay Digg.com BoingBoing FMForums.com EhMac.ca Craigslist Environment Canada Weather TreeHugger Joy of Tech System7Today The best overall experience has been with IE5 with style sheets turned off. It handles every site with the exception of Joy of Tech. Netscape is faster, again with style sheets turned off. It will do Joy of Tech. It does BoingBoing but it is an amazing dog's breakfast. Netscape fails on many of the graphics. iCab, I am just crashing. I do not know what I am doing wrong there. Opera is really frustrating. If you take Opera 5 and go to Digg.com, it quickly renders out the site and it looks like youa re home free. Then go to click any of the links and they are dead. I would really like any insight into this. From here I will do some FileMaker things. I have a few applications that I keep current in both the 5-6 and the 7-9 families of the application. 5.0 will run on 7.6. I will bind up some 5-6 family applications using FileMaker 5.0 and see how they run on 7.6 I also played with Quick Time player. Alas, it would appear that the current Quick Time sites have left 7.6 behind - even Apple. If anyone has some retro Quick Time sites to go to, I would love to go there or a selection of radio stations etc.
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Lichen Software
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128 MB Posts: 252
Reply #12 on: January 29, 2008, 14:48
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Per recommendations, I turned Appearance Manager Off. In this configuration Eudora 4.33 won't work. I went and got Eudora Light 3.1.3 and tried it. It does work. It allows you to leave mail on the server but it does not allow you to selectively remove it. This is not as good as 4.33 where I could make sure the spam never touched my main machine. It was interesting to configure but carefully reading the instructions and very literally following them, it configured up. The one that got me was having to put a user name @ the POP account. In the other version it was just the POP account. No nice buttons with this one, but it does nave filters and no advertisement pane. Hope this helps someone tryhing for Appearance Manager Offr and Eudora as an email client.
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dpaanlka
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1024 MB Posts: 1646
Reply #13 on: January 29, 2008, 19:19
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If a program requires Appearance, there is no way to get it to work without Appearance. Likewise, if a program requires Carbon Lib (WamCom, Netscape 7.2) there is no way to get it running under System 7 at all, at least not that I know of, and I doubt there is some way that I don't know of. Email and Web browsing are still quite unsatisfactory under System 7. The best classic browser IMHO is Netscape 7.2. WamCom is slower and older and not quite as polished as NS 7.2. With the open source availability of both Mozilla, Web Kit, and KHTML code, you'd think somebody somewhere would build a modern browser for Mac OS 7, 8 and 9. Even if it lacked a lot of features of OS X and Windows browsers, just so long as it displayed pages quickly and accurately I would be satisfied. As a side note, the only good email client under System 7 that works without Appearance is that built into Netscape 4.8, which is also probably the best overall System 7 browser.
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